Should NASA and SpaceX Launch A Crew? Yes – Safely. (Update)
The Mission NASA Doesn’t Want to Postpone, The Atlantic
“In this moment, an astronaut launch might seem to be the opposite of everything Americans have been instructed to do to protect themselves and one another: Flinging people outward doesn’t quite line up with a growing nationwide impulse to turn inward. The mission would unfold against a truly unprecedented backdrop; even wars and national strife, one space historian told me, haven’t posed a challenge to the U.S. space program like this pandemic has.” … “The space community often considers themselves a different level of somewhat unique and special in not having to adhere to the same rules as others–because what they’re doing is so important, it should still be done,” Garver said. “I will not be surprised if the public finds it not what they would view as ‘essential.'” I just think most people will say, ‘Well, people are dying here.'”
Keith’s 14 April note: A substantial number of states have decided that liquor stores, vaping shops, and marijuana businesses are “essential” and must be allowed to stay open. No one seems to be questioning the risk taken by the people who work there or frequent these businesses to say nothing of the adverse risks that using these substances have on people who catch the virus. Major league team sports are talking about ways to play their games in closed stadiums (which still require lots of people to operate) and every one seems to be happy about that. And everyone is ordering groceries from home to be safe – even if an army of people is required to risk their health to deliver that food.
Update: pro-wrestling has been declared an essential business in the state of Florida. Yes, pro wrestling.
If NASA and SpaceX have all personnel and resources required to safely – let me repeat safely – and the people involved volunteer to take the risks – and meet all aspects of mission operations they should go ahead with the launch. The people who manage and work at NASA and SpaceX are smart and understand the value of a safe workplace under COVID-19 constraints. In the end Jim and Elon will assess whether their people want to do this.
I think the public as a whole understands the importance of things such as missions to explore space. We all need something to aspire to right now – and hope that there will be a future out there when this nightmare is over.
Hope is essential – certainly much more so than beer, pot, and the playoffs.
Keith’s 19 April update: Just as long as everyone involved in this launch is safe – and feels safe – and wants to make this happen – then they should be allowed to make this happen.
Despite coronavirus, NASA and SpaceX aim to launch astronauts in May, Florida Today
“NASA has a space station to operate and we aren’t de-crewing it because of the virus,” said James Muncy, a Washington, D.C.-based space policy consultant. “Carrying off a first, safe Commercial Crew mission needs to happen for the nation to operate the station and to continue what we’re doing in space.” “It would be better if we didn’t have this pandemic and it would be better if a million people could come to Florida and fill up hotel rooms and you would get the full economic benefit of that first launch,” he said. “But NASA has to keep moving in space.” … Lori Garver, former deputy administrator of NASA, said her views “evolved this week” after recognizing the pandemic could last a year or more. “If the workforce is safe and SpaceX and NASA are ready – I agree it is a priority,” she said. “The U.S. has spent about $150 billion on ISS and it can’t postpone (astronaut) exchange and supplies that long.”
Two reasons: Tax revenue is one. The other is that alcoholics need their fix or they will end up in the ER with withdrawal symptoms. Which can be fatal.
What sports are up and running? No games on TV except replays of classic games from the past.
Major league baseball has been exploring the use of a stadium Arizona where they’d play all their games. https://thehill.com/blogs/b…
There’s also a fair amount of talk here in SW Florida about using the minor league parks once the season starts, the issue being that home stadiums might be otherwise booked.
There is a big difference between up and running and exploring how to restart the games. Every business in the US is doing planning on how to restart if they are closed or limited.
They are looking to run the baseball games in empty stadiums. Empty.
For what it’s worth, this morning’s news says, “World Wrestling Entertainment (WWE) has resumed airing live matches after being deemed an “essential service” in Florida.” I don’t really see the logic to that. I know some people staying at home all the time will be getting cabin fervor, and want entertainment. But wouldn’t sufficiently old events do? I’ve never seen Pele play soccer, and, honestly, knowing Brazil beat Sweden in the 1958 world cup wouldn’t spoil it for me. That was sort of obvious anyway.
I should note that the eSport leagues are going strong. And it’s what a lot of young folks who were raised playing video games instead of physical sports watch.
I personally see ISS as “essential”. Russia just launched a crew not long ago to ISS, so I don’t see why the US should shy away from doing the same.
During Apollo they use to quarantine the crews. I assume they have returned to that practice with the virus.
When did they stop?
I thought have always done it to prevent taking even a good old head cold up there with them.
No they have quarantined crews prior to flight for decades. Go ask the shuttle families what it was like to talk to their families inside the O&C building at KSC. Go look at the pictures of Soyuz crews holding press conferences behind big glass windows in Russia prior to launch.
That is good. I don’t know any Shuttle astronauts and I hadn’t seen much talk of the practice which is why was wondering about it but it is good they never stopped it.
Just out of curiosity, what are the quarantine procedures after astronauts return to Earth? I remember something people wintering over in Antarctica being more likely to catch colds or flu after going home. It had to do with spending months with a small group of people who didn’t have any germs to pass around. I’d think the same concern would apply to people returning from six months on the space station.
Why do you think a quarantine would help? It’s just delaying their return to life.
Quarantine was probably the wrong word. Let’s replace that with “precautions” and repeat the question.
Unless it is a matter of the health and safety of the support personnel which delays the safe launch, or should Congress or such severe public opinion cause the flight to be politically untenable, we should definitely launch the two astronauts to the ISS aboard the Crew Dragon. A successful flight may lift the spirits of our beleaguered country. In other words, PRESS ON!
With all respect to Dr. Garver, I have to disagree. She seems to think that operating ISS should be something exciting and the subject of great public interest. If that is true then I could understand her point. But I don’t agree with her assumption. I’ve said, repeatedly, that progress in space is all about making it routine and normal, and getting away from special events. A crew rotation to ISS should be business as usual, and in these troubled times, no different from driving a truck carrying food from Kansas to Wyoming.
This is undoubtedy the right way to look at it – it is what the Shuttle aimed at achieving, but never quite did.
That said, however, the first launch of American astronauts on Americans rockets from American soil (thanks, Jim!) in almost ten years – and the very first ever launched by a commercial operator – *should* be the occasion of some excitement and public interest. After that, let’s make it routine.
In the past it was the astronauts who risked their lives to extend human presence into space. Along with the mostly unsung closeout crew, the Ice Team (final inspection team) and the pad rescue team. Now the circle of heroes will potentially become much wider.
And why in blazes are gun stores essential? Good gosh man.
Or growing marijuana or liquor stores. Those are considered essential in Ohio.
Millions of us partake in the shooting sports, and those in the rural areas hunt small game for food. Even if you reload your ammo that requires powder, primers, projectiles, etc. and you can’t buy those at Whole Foods or Walmart
Sometimes lost in the discussion about guns: mutual respect. It’s an implied part of a country valuing equal protection.
My personal views regarding guns aren’t and shouldn’t be part of your own thought processes and ownership decisions.
This isn’t hard, folks.
Guns are simply not a priority here. If you look at how various areas are responding to CV-19 and the results they are having it is clear that where people are being inward looking, the results are bad, Where people are working together, the results are good. The time spent pursuing gun use would be far better spent in looking after your neighbors and seeing where you can help them in a positive sense.
I hate to start an off-topic debate, but burglaries are up in my area as a result of COVID-19, and I believe police response time is down a bit in the nation as a whole. I have lived in places where having a gun and looking after your neighbors were related, even if I don’t live in such a place today. If you never have lived in such a place, consider yourself fortunate. But don’t assume everyone is that fortunate.
The efficacy of owner gun ownership in the face of home break-ins has not been demonstrated.
It’s one of those ‘seems like’ things I like to yammer about.
Trying to stick to why some stores are open, even when it seems counterintuitive, the actual value of something may not matter. Since the closures and exceptions were issued by state governors, I believe the state constitutions are relevant documents. Many state constitutions are very explicit about armed selfdefense. That means the value does not have to be demonstrated for the right to be protected. (The same thing, of course, applies to freedom of assembly, of the press, etc.)
States can certainly restrict rights in emergencies. But if they are things specifically protected by a constitution, the courts tend to take a careful look at the justification. They want the restrictions to be narrowly tailored to the emergency. (Often, the courts delay ruling until after the emergency is over…)
Consider this: There is a bike store two blocks from my apartment which is still open (limited hours, no more than two customers at a time, etc…) I believe that follows from the fact that bike riding is a popular form of exercise around here, exercise is a specific exception to the state’s stay at home order, and the store’s business is relevant to that activity. But bike riding isn’t even mentioned in the state constitution, let along being a protected right. Someone could challenge the closure of gun stores, on the grounds that the state can’t be more restrictive of a business relevant to a protected right than of one relevant to an unprotected but socially desirable practice. The same logic which would hold if a state banned public assemblies of over 10 people and then said, “except to watch football games.” The courts would say that, if football games are ok, then political assemblies have to be as well. So there are cases where the governors’ hands are tied when it comes to “essential” and “nonessential” businesses.
(By the way, the studies on the subject of armed selfdefense go both ways, disagree by orders of magnitude and often use extremely poor methodology. That’s typical of highly politicized issues, where people want statistics to shout at each other. Personally, I check the methodology myself, ignore the studies where I see a problem, and only pay attention to the ones I think I can trust. The Justice Departments national crime victimization surveys, for example.)
I’m excited to have the capability to launch our astronauts from here! That being said, this seems like some “GO FEVER” That historically ends badly…
You have to be kidding. This isn’t anything close to GO FEVER.
Not kidding! this program is YEARS overdue.Our seats on Soyuz have not been established. We have a pandemic that most everything at NASA is at a diminished capacity at best… What could go wrong?
How do you know that SpaceX and NASA are working at diminished capacity with respect to the tentatively scheduled first manned Commercial Crew flight in May?
Welcome to democracy. “Essential” is what’s essential to the most people, since they’re what get votes for the genius leaders who have a vague idea of space as being “some sort of black thing in the sky”.
Lori Garver’s position frightens me, I hope she’s just naive and doesn’t know ISS needs to be manned continuously for maintenance and NASA already used its last seat on Soyuz. But there’s a darker interpretation: She doesn’t really care about ISS, in fact it would be better for her if ISS is lost, since it would free up money for her initiative to change NASA to a climate change mitigation agency, I sincerely hope this is not the case.
That is good. I don’t know any Shuttle astronauts and I hadn’t seen much talk of the practice which is why was wondering about it but it is good they never stopped it.